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Sunday, October 5, 2014

Slow-Rolling Away the Day

It's Sunday afternoon.  I'm back in the office (our new office) working to finish a brief.  Who needs to spend Sunday watching football when you can listen to the games online on Sirius/XM . . . I did, however, make it to the Shoe for some poker Saturday evening.  I took a modest loss on the session.  As has been the trend, recently, a lone hand did me in, turning what would have been a winning session into the red.

I started the hand with about $370.  Villain was sitting on about $250...  After 4 limpers, villain raises to $10 from the Cut-off.  I look down at a red AK in the big blind.  I think about raising, but not sure I want to build a big pot out of position.  Ultimately, after a short tank, I just call, and, after picking up one more, we go three to the flop:

K J 9 (two clubs).

I check my top pair and it checks to the original raiser, who bets $30.  I re-raise to $100.  It folds to villain who shoves.  It's $115 more to me.  I call fairly quickly, figuring there is a decent amount I'm ahead of, including some draws.  And, as I normally do, since I'm not a giant jackass, I table my hand.  Even though I did not have to.  Because, like, who gives a crap.  It's $1/3 NL.  Lets move things along . . .

Villain, however, does not table.  The turn blanks.  He still does not table.  I think he's drawing.  River falls as a harmless red deuce.  Only then does villain flip his QT for the flopped nuts.  Really?  Losing the hand really did not bother me.  But, I'll admit, I was somewhat tilted by Villain's etiquette.  Was it a slow roll?  Perhaps not as that term is traditionally thought of.  But, come on.  What is he worried about?  Me hitting runner, runner Broadway?  Anyway; maybe I was being a bit overly sensitive.  But he pissed me off.  He pissed me off even more when he cashed out with my $250 chips just minutes later after, like, a 30 minute session.    

In the end, I left down $95 . . . living to play another day . . .

25 comments:

  1. Amazing how oblivious (and rude) players are.

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  2. He deserved a quick blow to the testicles. Only thing in his favor might be that he was relatively new to b&m poker. The only reason I wonder about that is his cashing out so quickly. Who does that?

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    1. I don't think so. When he bought in, he received markers for his $200 . . . And the chip runner fell asleep on him for about 10 minutes. He seemed very comfortable playing hands in the meantime without chips . . . playing hands, making bets, and just verbalizing his action. I did not get the impression he was knew to the B&M game . . . But, whatever . . .

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  3. Revenge is a dish best served cold. You'd be surprised how may times I have had the opportunity to repay a slowroller or general etiquette abuser at the tables, sometimes after 3 or 4 years.

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  4. I am a very calm and level headed poker player. Slow rolling is the one thing that can send me over the edge. The best is when they pick up their hand, look at it, look intensely at the board, sigh, shake their head, flick their cards like they're disappointed, and then table the nuts.

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  5. I wonder if a re-raise, preflop, might have got him off that hand? I do understand being more comfortable playing in position, but it's a top 3 hand, and suited...I think you need to re-pop there. Particularly considering how wide his range is in that late of position.

    Perhaps 35 pre would have won it?

    The slow roll was particularly glaring, given he was required to show first after your call. I don't know what some people are thinking...

    s.i.

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    1. I agree, in hind-site, the three-bet likely would have taken the hand down preflop. And, even if it hadn't, the result would have been the same.

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  6. man,counselor. i know u missed out of that Navajo/U.S govt money with the lawyer fees BUT i hope u got on that Gravy TRAIN over the word "how" bwtween that yogurt company and some 3rd rate motoviational speakers company. no more train rides to NYC. G6 BIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITCHES

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  7. OK, I have to be the contrarian here and state that I don't object to the V's slow-rolling you....because he DIDN'T slow-roll you. At last the way you described it.

    Before the hand is complete, he is under NO OBLIGATION to show his hand, even when you did. Why wouldn't she show you that he flopped the nuts when all you showed was top pair? Well, he may just be one of those players who NEVER shows before the river (in a cash game, that is--in a tournament he'd have to, so maybe that's why he plays cash games, cuz he doesn't like to show early). Some players are very superstitious about that and think it's bad luck to show your hand before all the cards are dealt out. A poker player superstitious? Yeah, who'd a thunk it?

    Of course, it sounds like you were drawing dead after the turn didn't help you, but maybe he hadn't quite figured that out yet....or was holding to his "never show" policy. I really don't fault him.

    A true slow-roll would have been if he had waited for more than a second or two after the river hit the board. Then I think you would have a legitimate beef. As you describe, I don't have an issue.

    And also......please note that he was playing Coach's "evil hand"--Queen-10, so obviously he doesn't read his blog.

    Anyway, sorry for the bad beat. I don't fault you for not three-betting AK out of position, he just got ridiculously lucky.

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    1. contrarian??? i thought u were californian

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    2. Some players are very superstitious about that and think it's bad luck to show your hand before all the cards are dealt out.

      On the turn, PPP was drawing dead. Don't be a prick - Just turn the mofo over.

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    3. See, MOJO, you're a tournament player, where the players HAVE to show their hands as soon as everyong is all in. Cash games are different. Yes, on the turn, Pete was apparently drawing dead. But I've played against a lot of players who might not have figured out in the few seconds between the time he saw the turn card and the dealer put the river card down (would have been pretty fast since there was no betting action possible). OR, the guy might have been so superstitious that he felt showing early might have given him bad luck later in the session. I've seen players like that.

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    4. I played with a guy last night who at showdown would ALWAYS say something like "I have nothing, you're good", then show his worst card that didn't pair the board, then only after the other person showed their hand would he reveal his other card, which was sometimes a winner. He also slow rolled a chop on a guy, took him 30+ seconds to flip over the nuts after staring at the board and the other guys cards and shaking his head. He would also laugh out loud at his opponent(s) after winning a hand while stacking his chips. While he was a terrible player, he wasn't a rookie, he knew what he was doing violated poker etiquette. Of course a guy only has to do this once or twice before you realize what he is doing and force him to act in turn and not be surprised when he slow rolls you when you need to show first. But the first one can be painful if it happens to you.

      Even some high stakes poker players are very superstitious about showing their hands before the river. Sammy Farha comes to mind, but at least on TV he would generally tell his opponent where they are at relative to his hand, for example he would say something like I'm ahead, you're ahead, I'm on a draw, etc.

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  8. Replies
    1. 1-1 in NCAA . . . 2-0 NFL . . . On to this week!

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    2. so does that mean u cashed when 2-0? or r u playing head 2 head or double or nothing games??

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    3. I generally play all double or nothings . . . so split the college contests and swept the pros

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  9. Sorry to hear about the hand. This slow rolling usually is an MO of Koreans/Chinese. I am not sure whether this trait is them being conscious of the outcome or they don't even realize how rude it looks.

    As Mr Subliminal said, it's better to repay them with interest. I am pretty sure you didn't get a chance this time, but, do remember his face and remember it good. No bad act goes unpunished.

    A small story, sorry for this digression:
    Played with a Korean a few sessions back where he was getting on our nerves with his slow rolling. I raise with 6's, he calls. F: 235, I make a CBet, he calls. Turn 8, I make another bet, he goes AI, I call the rest, River 4, he slams his two 5's for a Set. I grimace, say oh man! I didn't put you on a set, then slowly turn over two 6's. The reaction was priceless.

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  10. Last one is the courtesy of GolfPro.

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  11. 3b or flat pre. Both are fine though I would tend to 3b. C/r this flop is bad though

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    1. Brian, what are your thoughts on the flop check-raise? Curious why you don't like it. Is it a matter or me being either way ahead or way behind? Thanks,

      P3

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    2. Kind of yeah. That's a super wet board but it's also a super wet board in our opponents eyes. I think c/r only gets action from hands we don't really want action from (ie hands ahead of ours). I do concede that we could get action from fl draws and maybe KQ, KT. But I think in general we shouldn't be looking to play for stacks on that board. If the board was K96 with 2 clubs for example, he would have fewer made hands in his continuing range and more draws so a c/r could be good.

      You also have multiple opponents between you and the raiser that should hit this board hard.

      Finally, when we bet we are trying to get our opponent to fold a better hand (that's not happening here) or call with a worse hand (there are some combos of worse hands that will call on this board...but not enough IMO).

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    3. Brian, thanks as always. Love your insight!

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